The KillerDAC Audio forum
General HIFI => Amplification (Pre/Power) => Topic started by: ozmillsy on September 02, 2010, 06:47:35 PM
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Hi Guys
Here is an amp that may go well with the killer DAC:
http://www.aksaonline.com/products/products_NAKSA70.html (http://www.aksaonline.com/products/products_NAKSA70.html)
Hugh has built me one and I have had it delivered to Mike's at the Gold Coast - it is being delivered today. Pop in for a listen if you are up that way and check out his new ML3's.
And yes for you WA guys I can arrange for it to be sent out that way so you can check it out with your Killer Dac's once we are finished with it up here.
Thanks
Bill
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Let us know what you think mate.
100% for sure.
Thanks
Bill
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Hi Guys
Got to hear this amp at the DAC shootout. Unfortunately the comparison was less than optimum in that what we were comparing it against were Mike Lehehans $20K Macintosh mono-blocks. These are very impressive looking and very powerful amplifiers. The comparison was also not level matched which of course favored the more powerful amp if it was in anyway played louder - which unfortunately I think it was.
OK now the scene has been set when I heard the amp what immediately struck me was a crystalline clarity, to me it was not transistor sounding nor was it valve sounding. The designer Hugh Dean thought it was valve like. I know the technical reason for this - the amp produces valve like even order distortion harmonics. I thought it was like a digital amp but without the metallic sheen that I find they can have. It also had a detailed lively sound - but I knew that would be the case since Hugh designed it like that. Interestingly Mike thought the amp smooth. To my ears it also had a light airy quality. While listening to it a number of guys came up and said how much they enjoyed it. This is a unique very good sounding non fatiguing amp.
Now for the contentious controversial bit. When those Macintosh's were switched in for comparison I and others thought they were a little better. Some guys however thought they are quite a bit better. Discussion ensured. The guys who thought they were quite a bit better said it was real. Personally I remained unconvinced. I conjecture the difference had to do with the unmatched levels. Mike thought the difference was the Macs has better bass grip but the NAKSA had a unique non fatiguing, smooth sound.
Anyway what I plan to do is leave it down at Mikes for a while so people can listen to it if they wish. Then I will bring it back to my place and do a formal comparison with my Sonofagum.
Thanks
Bill
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A friend of mine is making one of these so i may be able to snatch it and compare it to mine which i would love to do. The whole project sounds very interesting and promising. Also pics .... mmmm yum yum
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Hugh's a nice bloke and always willing to chat about all things audio
Yes indeed - top bloke. And those amps are truly unique. I still have that sound in my head - so clear yet with a light airy quality.
Thanks
Bill
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A friend of mine is making one of these so i may be able to snatch it and compare it to mine which i would love to do. The whole project sounds very interesting and promising. Also pics .... mmmm yum yum
Check out:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=81041.200
When I have done a bit more listening I will arrange for it to be sent to some trusted acquaintances in Sydney and Perth so others can hear it.
Thanks
Bill
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Thank you kindly Bill!
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bill soon your going to go through more gear then johnydarko.
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haha, bhobba, the new jonnydarko.
Bill, honestly mate, just buy killeramp, to go with killerdac, and then buy killer ML1.
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no no no i dont like copy cats hens (you and tuyen are enough)
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haha, you forced me Mario, I was happy with my headphones till you ruined it and emptied my wallet.
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haha, bhobba, the new jonnydarko.Bill, honestly mate, just buy killeramp, to go with killerdac, and then buy killer ML1.
No I like the killer Ml3's - already ordered them off Mike.
Thanks
Bill
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Very nice bhobba!
Please remember us and upload photos when you can.
I still have yet to see what final production ML-3s look like :)
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Hi Guys
Will be going down to Mike's some time next week to check out his first production run of the PDX. I was going to do it tomorrow but Mike was having troubles with the PCM1704 chips he was using - he was ripped off - they were fake. Evidently that sort of thing is becoming more common. People wonder why the cost of decent Hi Fi is going through the roof. Well that's one reason.
Anyway I will be taking my NAKSA down there to hear the PDX and Tranquility through it and the ML3's. I will leave it down there and have Mike send it on to Mario so you guys in Perth can check it out. I am sure Mike knows Mario's address so its simply a matter of you guys letting him know it's on its way.
Thanks
Bill
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Please remember us and upload photos when you can.I still have yet to see what final production ML-3s look like :)
Sorry guys forgot you were waiting on some pics - here they are:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=album;id=5438
Thanks
Bill
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Bill, any idea what day you are going down? I'd be keen to check out the final PDX..
Fake parts are getting pretty common especially capacitors and transistors, and very annoying, I've decided to stay away from anything that looks like it's being sent from, or will be sent from, China/HK from now on
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Cheers for the photos Bill. Those ML-3 look very nice indeed.
The photo of the reference model crossovers just makes my mouth water! ;D
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they looked much more impressive in the flesh, huge!
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Bill, any idea what day you are going down?
I am actually going down today because a guy is coming up from Melbourne and wants to hear the Tranquility, PDX, NAKSA and ML3's. You can come down today if you like at about 11.00. But that will just be the prototype PDX. Mike doesn't know exactly what day the first production run of the PDX will be finished but is expected some day next week. Will keep you informed. May be able to send the NAKSA off today.
Thanks
Bill
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Bill, won't be able to make it today, might of been able to manage some time next week, I'll just wait for shootout number 2 :)
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Bill, won't be able to make it today, might of been able to manage some time next week, I'll just wait for shootout number 2 :)
No problemo. That will occur when Mike has the first production run of the PDX with the USB input and we compare it to the Tranquility. Will let you know what day it is on - but is expected to be sometime next week. In fact I will ensure it is on a day you are available since Mike can't do it without me as I have taken the Tranquility back to my place. Trouble is it needs a pre amp so I will have to use my little Redgum rather than the NAKSA - while an excellent amp - especially for the money - is not quite as good as the NAKSA - but then again it is much cheaper and the NAKSA is incredible value of money. Because of that I have sent the NAKSA off to Mario for him and the other Perth guys to check out. Watch this space for what they think.
Anyway see my next post for how today went down at Mikes.
Thanks
Bill
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Hi Guys
Initially wasn't going down to Mike's but a guy came up from Melbourne specifically to check out the WFS, PDX, Tranquility and NAKSA. So off I went taking the NAKSA and WFS - the Tranquility and WFS was already there.
First off he much preferred the Tranquility and the PDX to the WFS. He heard the issues I had been writing about with the WFS - including the sibilance but thought it was not that bad and I had probably become a bit sensitive to it. However he thought it, while detailed, was constrained and closed while the other two DAC's were open. As I had previously noted the Tranquility had a rather dry sound while the PDX was fuller and richer. He preferred the PDX and that is what he will be getting.
Oh and like everyone who has heard them was quite impressed with the ML3 speakers Mike is working on.
Ok how did the NAKSA go. Very very well thank you. We had been listening to Mikes much more expensive Macintosh's. When we put the NAKSA in, this time properly level matched, the initial reaction was - did you change the amp? Basically he said if he had left the room he could not have known the amp was changed. Well having listened to both amps a lot I could hear some differences - basically in the NAKSA's favor - it was a touch more non transistor like - a little smother and perhaps more easy listening and clearer. But when pushed hard, as you would expect with 500W of power, those Macintosh's shone - their grip was simply amazing. But keep it to sane levels and it was a very close thing with, IMHO, the slight edge going to the NAKSA for being more relaxing and easier to listen to. Now bear in mind those Macintosh's, while of course excellent amps, cost $20K. To me, unless you like to listen at frightening loud levels, its a no-brainer - get the NAKSA. That was the opinion of the Melbourne guy as well. That was the opinion of the Melbourne guy as well. Right throughout listening to the NAKSA he had a smile on his face just like Hugh (the designer of the NAKSA) mentioned of the person who listened to an amp he designed many years ago called the glass harmony. He would sit there for hours listening to it with a beatific smile on his face. In fact one of Hugh's goals was to equal; or even exceed that amp. IMHO with the NAKSA he has succeeded. Naturally he is going to get one.
But being the kind of guy I am and rather liking the idea of sharing a good thing I got Mike to ship it off to you guys in Perth who are into the Killer DAC for them to check it out on their predominately valve systems. A very interesting comparison indeed and look forward to what you find out. Mario should have it in the next few days.
Thanks
Bill
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Trouble is it needs a pre amp so I will have to use my little Redgum rather than the NAKSA - while an excellent amp - especially for the money - is not quite as good as the NAKSA - but then again it is much cheaper and the NAKSA is incredible value of money.
If you need a preamp I could bring my VSE SVP-2, but didn't Mike's NM-24 have a line stage? IIRC.
I'd be keen to hear both the Tranquility and the PDX again, so let me know a rough time frame and I'll make sure I can get some time off. I need to see Mike about maybe ordering some Duelunds too :)
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If you need a preamp I could bring my VSE SVP-2, but didn't Mike's NM-24 have a line stage? IIRC. I'd be keen to hear both the Tranquility and the PDX again, so let me know a rough time frame and I'll make sure I can get some time off. I need to see Mike about maybe ordering some Duelunds too :)
A pre amp is not a problem - Mike has one. Although you still can bring yours along if you like. Now I know you are interested I will ensure it is at a time you are available. This test though will be much tougher and more though than what has been done previously. Both DAC's will be fed by USB so it will be an apples to apples comparison. We can also compare the PDX's USB to Mike's top of the line tricked out transport and it will be fairer this time because it will be via I2S.
Oh and should anyone wish to join us drop me a line and we will see what can be done.
Thanks
Bill
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Bill, ok, that sounds like it would be very interesting, keep me updated
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Hi Mario and Other Perth Guys
Hugh just mentioned on his forum he is really looking forward to hearing what you guys think of his amp. That's because he knows you are really serious about sound quality. Mike sent it Monday and should be arriving at Mario's soon. This is really an interesting sounding amp and what you guys think will be much appreciated.
Thanks
Bill
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Really appreciate your generosity Bill.
Will look forward to hearing the amp in a few of systems down here in Perth :)
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thanks bill all i need to do is get a pre amp so i can run the naksa in my system.
ANYBODY IN PERTH WITH A PRE?
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all i need to do is get a pre amp so i can run the naksa in my system.
ANYBODY IN PERTH WITH A PRE?
I am sure someone will put their hands up. But if for some unknown reason they don't I know a guy down Perth way who may be able to help. Let me know if it is an issue.
Thanks
Bill
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what about the lightspeed?!?
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what about the lightspeed?!?
i will try it but my dac is 2.8k remember
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hey ozcal i think you should listen to this amp if anyone comes down my way they can take it to you.
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I have a pre Mario
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i will try it but my dac is 2.8k remember
Dont tell me you've given up on it before giving it a go? :o Not an ideal impedance match, but still, who knows....
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i will try it but my dac is 2.8k remember
Dont tell me you've given up on it before giving it a go? :o Not an ideal impedance match, but still, who knows....
i havent given up oz i just need back up in case i will fire up the lightspeed on saturday morning.2 options are better then one :D
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I have a pre Mario
thats good hens what is it?
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You've probably never heard of it Mario.
It does have tubes though :P
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hey ozcal i think you should listen to this amp if anyone comes down my way they can take it to you.
Thanks Mario , look forward to it.
Gordon
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Hi Mario and Other Perth Guys
Hope Mario has got this amp in his hot little hands. If so does anyone have any initial impressions? I know Hugh has heard your (meaning all the Perth guys - not just Mario) rep as really committed audiophiles and is keen to hear what you think of this amp. Everyone who has heard it simply can't believe it's solid state.
Thanks
Bill
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Hi Mario and Other Perth Guys
Hope Mario has got this amp in his hot little hands. If so does anyone have any initial impressions? I know Hugh has heard your (meaning all the Perth guys - not just Mario) rep as really committed audiophiles and is keen to hear what you think of this amp. Everyone who has heard it simply can't believe it's solid state.
Thanks
Bill
amp not here yet bill ::)
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amp not here yet bill ::)
Just spoke to Mike and evidently you rang him just 5 minutes ago to say it arrived and you are on your way right now to check it out. Really looking forward to hearing what you find out.
Thanks
Bill
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your right bill this amp represents great value by hugh,its a very good amp for people looking for a smooth ss amp and no tube changing.great bottom amp man it can drive the ml1 in a tight punchy presentation like i never heard before on a ss amp.
tuyen will be picking it up from my mates house next week so it can go to ozcals house where he runs ss amps in his system it will be a fair comparison.(ozcal your b&w speakers will be dancing with bottom end this thing is punchy like mike tyson in his earlier days)
move over belcanto,ME,parasound and most other ss amps which cost a lot more.
full credit to hugh delivering value for money like that to australian music lovers.
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Hmmm, interesting comments Mario, how was the sund staging and imaging?
I'll have to head over to Tuyens next week.
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Hmmm, interesting comments Mario, how was the sund staging and imaging?
I'll have to head over to Tuyens next week.
its better in sound staging then joe rasmussen jlti intergrated mk2 which i owned before it was a gain clone amp mudule.
imaging is also very good.
my views are based on other ss amps which i heard i am not comparing it to the killer el34 as i am biased towards valves
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Hmmmm, interesting...
If I build one for fun will I ever use it once Paul sends me my amps?
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your right bill this amp represents great value by hugh,its a very good amp for people looking for a smooth ss amp and no tube changing.great bottom amp man it can drive the ml1 in a tight punchy presentation like i never heard before on a ss amp.tuyen will be picking it up from my mates house next week so it can go to ozcals house where he runs ss amps in his system it will be a fair comparison.(ozcal your b&w speakers will be dancing with bottom end this thing is punchy like mike tyson in his earlier days) move over belcanto,ME,parasound and most other ss amps which cost a lot more.full credit to hugh delivering value for money like that to australian music lovers.
Thanks for checking it out Mario. And I am glad you like it. I too am starting to come around to the valve way of thinking and can see myself getting some further down the line. Mike is getting some designed to replace his Macintosh's. He is hopeful they will beat them and in a few ways those Macs do outshine the NAKSA. But for guys that don't like changing valves it really is a good choice. The Macintosh's and the NAKSA are the two best SS amps I have heard. I would say two best amps but I have high hopes for Mikes amps. Of course I have not heard them since they have not been even built yet - but I trust Mike when he says they will likely beat them.
Thanks
Bill
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next year i will pull the pin and get a 100w naksa hot rodd it and use it in a diffrent room so my wife can play her music and dont have to hide underneath the bed when she plays her current teac.
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Hi Guys
Whats the latest with you WA guys and the NAKSA? Any further reports? Has Mario had the chance to do any mods yet?
Thanks
Bill
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the naksa will be making its way up north of the river in about 2 weeks gordon will play it on his sytem.
bill ask mike for some speaker binding posts and female rca's i need them for the modd
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the naksa will be making its way up north of the river in about 2 weeks gordon will play it on his sytem. bill ask mike for some speaker binding posts and female rca's i need them for the modd
Great to hear people are getting to hear it. I will be seeing Mike tomorrow to check out a buzz/hum problem I have with the Tranquility. I will get him to send out what he thinks would be the best to use.
Thanks
Bill
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Any update on the NAKSA and what people think? Mario mentioned it was going north of the river - any of those guys have any comments?
thanks
Bill
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I think only Mario and his friend Richard have listened to it so far.
Both very much enjoy it and think it's one of the best SS amps they have heard for the money so far.
I believe the amp is still with Mario, who says he will hopefully drop it down to flemo's place this weekend. Then flemo, ozcal and few other nearby locals can check it out.
Again, thanks for sharing your toys and giving us the opportunity to hear your naksa amp, Bill.
Tuyen
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Great to hear. Looking forward to hearing what others think. No hurry - need my PDX for it to really be any use to me anyway since it has a volume control and the Tranquility does not -and Clay is run off his feet with orders on the PDX so it won't be for a while. Can hardly wait to get the PDX out to you guys along with the Tranquility and WFS DAC to check against the Killer. I think the WFS wont really be in the hunt, the Tranquility will fare better but the one that will be a close thing will be the PDX. I suspect the Killer will pip the PDX but it certainly will be an actual contest.
Thanks
Bill
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I think only Mario and his friend Richard have listened to it so far.
Both very much enjoy it and think it's one of the best SS amps they have heard for the money so far.
I believe the amp is still with Mario, who says he will hopefully drop it down to flemo's place this weekend. Then flemo, ozcal and few other nearby locals can check it out.
Again, thanks for sharing your toys and giving us the opportunity to hear your naksa amp, Bill.
Tuyen
its going up to flemo's this weekend i had it with last time i forgot to leave it their :'(
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Hi Bill,
Have the Naksa here mate and just emailed Gordon (Ozcal) to arrange a delivery to him early next week as I don't have a preamp.
Really looking forward to hearing it with his 401's, and my 402's! It could just the ticket!
A mini Gale shootout? ;)
Cheers
flemo.
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Hi Flemo
Great to hear mate. Really looking forward to hearing what you think of the NAKSA. I owned Gale 402's for yonks before upgrading to my previous speakers Axis LS88's. So hearing how they go on the Gales will be very interesting. They are known as amp killers due to their difficult load - and the fact they actually by all reports wrecked a few amps. This will actually be a tough test for the NAKSA - or indeed any amp you put on it.
Thanks
Bill
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Hi bhobba , Pete very kindly dropped the amp off on Monday night.
Unfortunately I am as sick as a dog at the moment and haven't even got round to taking it out of it's box yet.
Hopefully I'll be OK by the weekend and we can put the amp through it's paces.
Gordon
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Pete very kindly dropped the amp off on Monday night. Unfortunately I am as sick as a dog at the moment and haven't even got round to taking it out of it's box yet. Hopefully I'll be OK by the weekend and we can put the amp through it's paces.
Hi Gordon
Sorry to hear you are not feeling well. By far the most important thing is to get well. Checking out the NAKSA can wait until you are feeling better. No rush or hurry.
Thanks
Bill
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Thanks Bill.It will be really interesting to hear how the Naksa sounds with the Supratek pre and the Gales.
Gordon
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Hi Guys
Now that Hugh has released the 100W NAKSA I think I will be upgrading to that. So if anyone wants to buy this NAKSA let me know and we can work out a price.
Thanks
Bill
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OZCAL how is it? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
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Hi guy's I have Bell's Palsy , which is a type of temporary facial paralysis. So apart from looking like I have had a stroke my hearing is affected and everything sounds horrible.
If any of the regulars want to pick up the amp for audition just pm me and I will confirm the loan with Bill.
Gordon
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Hi guy's I have Bell's Palsy , which is a type of temporary facial paralysis. So apart from looking like I have had a stroke my hearing is affected and everything sounds horrible. If any of the regulars want to pick up the amp for audition just pm me and I will confirm the loan with Bill.
Hi Gordon.
Sorry to hear that. Hope you get well real soon. As long as you or Mario is happy with it anyone that wants to try it out is welcome. But if no one wants to put up their hand then it might be time to send it onto Alan in Bunbury - that is of course providing no-one wants to buy it in the mean time.
Thanks
Bill
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gee... bill...
nice to see your gonna upgrade to the big bro naksa...
how much for the naksa70?
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gee... bill...
nice to see your gonna upgrade to the big bro naksa...
how much for the naksa70?
$1400
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bargain to be had by someone
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bargain to be had by someone
I think its a fair price. But if no one puts up their hand to check it out or buy it I have no problem with OZCAL keeping it until he is well enough to check it out.
Thanks
Bill
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I was able to pick up the Naksa amp this arvo from from Gordon and just got it set up to the kdac, CD94 CDT, and Gale 402's. I'm currently running the Naksa through the preamp of a vintage Nakamichi receiver kindly on loan from Wolster.
I'm trying hard to quantify the sound as I still have the memory of the V8 Mingda and ML1 Ultra's in my head, so going to the Gale 402's with a SS pre & power amp is somewhat different, it takes some getting used too!
My initial impressions are that it drives the Gales quite well, plenty of grunt with control and balance. It's quite clean, detailed and lively.
It will take a while for my ears to adjust to this new sound (SS & Gales) as I am used to that liquidity and effortless richness of tubes with the synergy of the Ultra's with those wonderful Duelund caps.
The Naksa has a dynamic and punchy presence but IMO it would be worthwhile hearing the Naksa with a built in volume pot, therefore removing the preamp all together so I can gauge the potential of this amp.
I hope to have my Accuphase amp up and running soon so it would be interesting to compare them both driving the Gales.
Thanks for the opportunity to listen to the Naksa Bill. ;)
Cheers, flemo.
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The Naksa has a dynamic and punchy presence but IMO it would be worthwhile hearing the Naksa with a built in volume pot, therefore removing the preamp all together so I can gauge the potential of this amp. I hope to have my Accuphase amp up and running soon so it would be interesting to compare them both driving the Gales.
Hi Flemo
Thanks for checking this amp out. I too believe it would work well with a passive pre-amp like a light-speed - even the designer Hugh thinks it would be good that way. I will be using its big 100W brother with a PDX which has a built in light-speed.
Take your time checking it out. Hopefully Gordon will be feeling better soon and can check it out when you are finished.
Thanks
Bill
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ok.. i'll chime in.. my naksa has been playing for a few hours since i've assembled it.
i bought this amp to power my altec's which i'm still waiting on the baffle.
So i fired the naksa up with some cheap speakers i have..and boy - i'm very impressed by it. The very best of solid state that i have heard. smooth and engaging. Aussie made! i'd love to hear the 100's.
i'm using a alps 20k volume. on friday a takman 20k arrived from the uk (i have used this before in the mingda v8). i'll give it a few more hours before adding the attenuator.
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ok.. i'll chime in.. my naksa has been playing for a few hours since i've assembled it.
i bought this amp to power my altec's which i'm still waiting on the baffle.
So i fired the naksa up with some cheap speakers i have..and boy - i'm very impressed by it. The very best of solid state that i have heard. smooth and engaging. Aussie made! i'd love to hear the 100's.
i'm using a alps 20k volume. on friday a takman 20k arrived from the uk (i have used this before in the mingda v8). i'll give it a few more hours before adding the attenuator.
Did you get the 70w or 100w version?
I must admit, based on the comments from Mario, Pete and yourself, if I was looking for SS, this is where I would start.
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70w version..
the 100w has just been released. Plus i dont need bundles of power for my high efficient altecs.
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Hi Guys
Just letting you know I have sold my NAKSA in preparation for getting the 100W version a bit down the line. The guy that is buying it has not finalized the purchase so no need to ship it off yet - just letting you know that will be following shortly.
Thanks guys for checking it out and all the trouble various people went to give others the opportunity to hear it.
Thanks
Bill
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Bill, congrats on the sale, and well done for sharing it around.
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Hi All
Could whoever has got the NAKSA please contact me to make arrangements to send it to the person that has purchased it. I think its Flemo who I will also send a PM.
Thanks
Bill