Author Topic: Resistor games  (Read 21559 times)

Offline Jehuty

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1385
  • Liked: 110
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #60 on: August 12, 2014, 07:37:15 PM »
Very nice job there! How many hours did you put in?  :o
Not all that matters can be measured, not all that can be measured matters.

Offline stevenvalve

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1489
  • Liked: 259
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #61 on: August 12, 2014, 07:42:45 PM »
Attenuator complete ready for install;


I might have misted it, what brand of resistor are they, some kind of foil. I must say, it looks real good.

Offline Jehuty

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1385
  • Liked: 110
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #62 on: August 12, 2014, 07:56:48 PM »
I might have misted it, what brand of resistor are they, some kind of foil. I must say, it looks real good.

Charcroft foils Steve.
Not all that matters can be measured, not all that can be measured matters.

Offline kajak12

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2444
  • Liked: 66
    • http://killerdac.com/forum/index.php
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #63 on: August 17, 2014, 10:40:59 PM »
I might have misted it, what brand of resistor are they, some kind of foil. I must say, it looks real good.
Great job  i hope the colouration works well in your system......................
still discovering the link between electronics and audio reproduction.so much to learn and so little time

Offline skc

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 58
  • Liked: 19
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #64 on: August 18, 2014, 07:52:48 AM »
Great job  i hope the colouration works well in your system......................

Thanks Kajak; I guess when it comes to colouration, your experience is unparalleled.  :)

Jokes aside, I have tried at least a half dozen other types of resistors in the signal path in this mix. The Charcrofts were easily superior to anything else I tried.

Offline vitavoxdude

  • Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1137
  • Liked: 60
  • Caring and sharing
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #65 on: August 18, 2014, 10:01:56 AM »
Yes Charcrofts and Vishay VSRJ's bulk foils are exceptionally clean sounding with all the detail.  The 'nude' one's perhaps even cleaner.  Using them in feedback loops is great as they don't place to much signature on anything IMV.  The biggest issue is their low power handling being typically 0.25 - 0.5w.

I bought a switched attenuator around 25 years ago when each resistor was around 30 dollars each(VSRJ's), ouch that hurt but it beat hands down  the then popular Holco precision 1w 0.5% metal films!

There has been much talk about the best resistors and here it is hard to definitively say which is best as it depends entirely on where in a circuit they are placed.  Here is where the 'art' in mixing and matching comes into effect. 

The switched attenuator, is it a series unit where the sound passes through each additive resistor or one where there is a single value to earth with a single resistor in the signal path?  The latter is much better IMV.

V
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline skc

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 58
  • Liked: 19
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #66 on: August 18, 2014, 12:56:46 PM »

The switched attenuator, is it a series unit where the sound passes through each additive resistor or one where there is a single value to earth with a single resistor in the signal path?  The latter is much better IMV.

V

It is a ladder switch, so only one Rx and one Ry value per position.

Offline vitavoxdude

  • Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1137
  • Liked: 60
  • Caring and sharing
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #67 on: August 18, 2014, 01:31:19 PM »
That's the best solution then for resistors.  ;D What overall impedance is it?  47k, 100k, 250k? This is the final arbiter as getting this match incorrect will effect the overall result.
V
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline skc

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 58
  • Liked: 19
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #68 on: August 18, 2014, 02:00:51 PM »
100k impedance.

Offline Pixelplay

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 11
  • Liked: 2
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #69 on: September 01, 2017, 04:57:23 PM »
With 2w Shinkoh's almost a distant memory and now assigned to the designation or "Rocking Horse Sh1t" are we any closer to finding a suitable replacement? AB's are great but not up to the Shinkoh's.
Any further input would be most welcome as I am collecting the goods to build my very own Killer 50 amp.

Offline vitavoxdude

  • Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1137
  • Liked: 60
  • Caring and sharing
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #70 on: September 01, 2017, 05:48:36 PM »
The new(ish) range from Audio Note UK of 1 and 2 watt non magnetic resistors sounds OK to me.  They have a real quality feel to them too with top quality lead in wires.  They look fab as well.  The Non magnetic part is important to avoid smear through magnetics.  I have several fitted to my preamp and have no urge to remove them.  Hope this helps.  I buy mine through the HiFi collective back in the UK, they are reliable and reasonably quick too.

Oh and if you have deep pockets you could try their same range in Silver lead outs.
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline hedalfa2

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 32
  • Liked: 3
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #71 on: September 03, 2017, 08:00:09 AM »
I have used hi fi collective they provide good service.

Offline stevenvalve

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1489
  • Liked: 259
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #72 on: September 04, 2017, 06:45:37 PM »
The new(ish) range from Audio Note UK of 1 and 2 watt non magnetic resistors sounds OK to me.  They have a real quality feel to them too with top quality lead in wires.  They look fab as well.  The Non magnetic part is important to avoid smear through magnetics.  I have several fitted to my preamp and have no urge to remove them.  Hope this helps.  I buy mine through the HiFi collective back in the UK, they are reliable and reasonably quick too.

Oh and if you have deep pockets you could try their same range in Silver lead outs.
I have tried these but for me they where not as good as the Shinkoh's, so system dependant.

Offline vitavoxdude

  • Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1137
  • Liked: 60
  • Caring and sharing
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #73 on: September 04, 2017, 09:46:16 PM »
How long did you have them in circuit Steve?  Did you use the one watt or two watt versions.? I was quite surprised at their weight and quality feel compared to the usual Allen Bradleys. Shinkoh's are not always available more the shame.  I'd be interested in what others think too.

Maybe you can come up with a where best to use the various types to add weight or colour or vibrancy etc. :) :) :) :) :)
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline stevenvalve

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1489
  • Liked: 259
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #74 on: September 04, 2017, 11:09:15 PM »
How long did you have them in circuit Steve?  Did you use the one watt or two watt versions.? I was quite surprised at their weight and quality feel compared to the usual Allen Bradleys. Shinkoh's are not always available more the shame.  I'd be interested in what others think too.

Maybe you can come up with a where best to use the various types to add weight or colour or vibrancy etc. :) :) :) :) :)
To be fair to the 2 watt audionote resistors, my system was tuned for the shinkoh and when i replaced a 1 watt shinkoh for the 2 watt audionote it changed the balance so much so i only ran the audionote for an hour.

Offline vitavoxdude

  • Beauty is in the ear of the beholder
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1137
  • Liked: 60
  • Caring and sharing
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #75 on: September 05, 2017, 09:15:35 PM »
Just checked and the shinko resistors are cheaper by a fair bit 8 UKP each compared to 13.75 UKP for the audio note non magnetic 2 watters. The AN tantalum with the silver leads are a fair bit more at 32.35 UKP each so it gets expensive pretty quickly.

I was hoping that some of our readers could chip in with long term experiences using the Audio Note resistors or any other 2 w types and where in the circuit they found they worked best.  I would think 40 hours running time would settle them in enough.
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline guru

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 21
  • Liked: 19
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #76 on: September 06, 2017, 01:52:44 PM »
Whilst it's all well to compare the price of 2 watt Shinkoh's to AN, have you actually looked at the values available and were the ones for 8 Pounds usable in any circuits you want to use them in. The remaining stock are all values rarely used hence the quantity available, all the commonly used values show zero stock. Shinkoh haven't been manufactured for at least 10 years now if not longer.
As for run in time on AN resistors, they don't even begin to sound the way they should until at least 80 hours run time. The system I used at the recent show in Sydney had at least 60 of the silver resistors in circuit both in the amp and cd player and the minimum run time was 150 hours for those.

Offline stevenvalve

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1489
  • Liked: 259
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #77 on: September 06, 2017, 02:34:05 PM »
Whilst it's all well to compare the price of 2 watt Shinkoh's to AN, have you actually looked at the values available and were the ones for 8 Pounds usable in any circuits you want to use them in. The remaining stock are all values rarely used hence the quantity available, all the commonly used values show zero stock. Shinkoh haven't been manufactured for at least 10 years now if not longer.
As for run in time on AN resistors, they don't even begin to sound the way they should until at least 80 hours run time. The system I used at the recent show in Sydney had at least 60 of the silver resistors in circuit both in the amp and cd player and the minimum run time was 150 hours for those.
I must say the Audionote system (to my ears) was the best sound at the Sydney HiFi show, but i did not listen to every room. I probably need to run the Audionote resistors in for a lot longer, and i may do that. Guru's sound was very good. As for the price of these resistors, they are expensive, but how much do we spend on our music systems.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 11:12:36 PM by stevenvalve »

Offline yarhevarhe

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
  • Liked: 0
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #78 on: September 06, 2017, 06:48:50 PM »
... As for run in time on AN resistors, they don't even begin to sound the way they should until at least 80 hours run time. The system I used at the recent show in Sydney had at least 60 of the silver resistors in circuit both in the amp and cd player and the minimum run time was 150 hours for those.
that sounds very reasonable to me.    One hour is nowhere near enough time (not even close and not even in cooee) for burnin (nor settling) except perhaps for Jaycar resistors and even then perhaps not.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 07:09:27 PM by yarhevarhe »

Offline yarhevarhe

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
  • Liked: 0
Re: Resistor games
« Reply #79 on: September 06, 2017, 07:05:31 PM »
... Sydney HiFi show,
Does SNA run the Sydney HiFi show or the Melbourne HiFi show?
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 07:07:15 PM by yarhevarhe »