Author Topic: Isolation platforms  (Read 3426 times)

Offline kajak12

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Isolation platforms
« on: August 28, 2011, 12:55:44 AM »
http://www.kineticsystems.com/page.php/id/532

i would like to try this it looks fancy
still discovering the link between electronics and audio reproduction.so much to learn and so little time

Offline vitavoxdude

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Re: Isolation platforms
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2011, 01:22:56 AM »
Should work well beneath a CD transport Mario, how much are they??
Isolation supports bring around 5 to 10% max in overall performance from what I have played with.
These include inflated with air bicycle innertubes sanwiched between two plates
Innertubes filled with low viscosity oil between plates
Sand filled boxes with inner board top plate
Ye olde paving slab mounted on squash balls
Aerolam
MDF
HDF
Glass - toughened treated in a special way
Chipboard of an uneven make up grain wise
Marine ply 30mm down to 6mm with the ply numbers changed and wood types
Various isolating cones inc Ali, ceramic, wood
Chefs hardwood chopping boards
3 legged customised stands

What have you tried????
All things I thought would be good fun for the Audio club but alas it looks like there are only 3 or 4 takers so I don't think I will bother spending 50+ K for so few other like minded persons.
V
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline Jehuty

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Re: Isolation platforms
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2011, 02:00:44 AM »
US$2k, http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue50/vibraplane.htm
I'd rather buy more Duelunds  :P
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Offline vitavoxdude

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Re: Isolation platforms
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2011, 01:05:36 PM »
Hmmmmm and that's for the cheap one, mind you in the land of Hifi salesmen that could almost be considerd cheap!  :-X
Tweaksville has never been so whacky, looks like ermmm too.  That air pump will make some noise and not excatly high WAF being industrial.
Oh well, back to the reality of selected geometries, sandwiched selected density materials and home made stands  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Much better value is the stand that's tuned to drain away vibration from the component, oopps, but that's letting the cat out of the bag. :-X :-X :-X :-X
V
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline flemo

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Re: Isolation platforms
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2011, 06:29:04 PM »
I found the Vibrapods to be an excellent product.  I currently have my CD85 sitting a piece of Hexalite (or Aerolam board) with 4 x Vibrapods underneath that.  

I have experimented extensively using MDF, ply, acrylic, hexalite, chipboard, corian and solid timber platforms.  What was overwhelmingly evident to me was the smaller the surface area of the platform the less vibration was able to interact with the component.  I also concluded cutting large oval or circular shaped holes out of the centre of shelves or platforms reduced the surface area and allowed the vibration to dissipate.  I know that sounds really simple, but reducing the surface area of component shelves and platforms is quite significant IME.

I basically cut a piece of MDF the exact size of the component, cut the centre out of it, and attach 4 x Vibrapods underneath.  

IME coupling or decoupling using spikes for components never yielded any gains I could hear in my system(s), except for speakers.  IME dampening components always provided immediate and significant audible gains.

IME the humble Vibrapod is the best isolation tweak I have used.  

Offline Jehuty

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Re: Isolation platforms
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2011, 07:11:13 PM »
I found the Vibrapods to be an excellent product.  I currently have my CD85 sitting a piece of Hexalite (or Aerolam board) with 4 x Vibrapods underneath that.  

I have experimented extensively using MDF, ply, acrylic, hexalite, chipboard, corian and solid timber platforms.  What was overwhelmingly evident to me was the smaller the surface area of the platform the less vibration was able to interact with the component.  I also concluded cutting large oval or circular shaped holes out of the centre of shelves or platforms reduced the surface area and allowed the vibration to dissipate.  I know that sounds really simple, but reducing the surface area of component shelves and platforms is quite significant IME.

I basically cut a piece of MDF the exact size of the component, cut the centre out of it, and attach 4 x Vibrapods underneath.  

IME coupling or decoupling using spikes for components never yielded any gains I could hear in my system(s), except for speakers.  IME dampening components always provided immediate and significant audible gains.

IME the humble Vibrapod is the best isolation tweak I have used.  

Thanks for sharing flemo, I will try vibrapods one day, the price is reasonable and I am more confident as you've got first hand experience with it.

Cheers,
William
Not all that matters can be measured, not all that can be measured matters.

Offline audiophool

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Re: Isolation platforms
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2011, 07:23:17 PM »
I use Vibrapods and Vibracones under my CDP and feel them to be worthwhile.
Worth noting that they are available in different grades according to the total mass to be supported.
My experiments indicated that it was important to use the appropriate ones according to the mass of the component.

Offline vitavoxdude

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Re: Isolation platforms
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2011, 11:17:19 AM »
I found the Vibrapods to be an excellent product.  I currently have my CD85 sitting a piece of Hexalite (or Aerolam board) with 4 x Vibrapods underneath that. 

I have experimented extensively using MDF, ply, acrylic, hexalite, chipboard, corian and solid timber platforms.  What was overwhelmingly evident to me was the smaller the surface area of the platform the less vibration was able to interact with the component.  ;) I also concluded cutting large oval or circular shaped holes out of the centre of shelves or platforms reduced the surface area and allowed the vibration to dissipate.  I know that sounds really simple, but reducing the surface area of component shelves and platforms is quite significant IME.

I basically cut a piece of MDF the exact size of the component, cut the centre out of it, and attach 4 x Vibrapods underneath. 

IME coupling or decoupling using spikes for components never yielded any gains I could hear in my system(s), except for speakers.  IME dampening components always provided immediate and significant audible gains.

IME the humble Vibrapod is the best isolation tweak I have used.   
Hi Flemo

Yes agree, it's the cutting of the hole which has a large influence as it prevents a lot of the internal standing wave type resonances within the platform through avoiding parallel sides and entrapment of sound beneath the unit.  ;)
Pagode makes some really good sounding stands at a price and they manage this with clever decoupling and thin shelves using several materials, all interesting stuff, that old warhorse Max Townsend also is responsible for a great decoupling stand through clever mechanics but these are for dedicated types with relatively deep pockets.  Both of these manufactures appear to apply different techniques to improve reproduction, one is lightweight so does not 'store energy' and the other decouples and dissipates energy.

Light weight components are effected by sound  vibrations more readily than higher mass devices (obvious) but much like materials their internal resonances change accordingly, some of these colourations are more objectionable than others, adding mass will affect these characteristics.  Since a lot of people have moved on from turntables the thought of decoupling appears to have been lower on the agenda than should have been.  All those that use 'sideboards' or stereo / TV type units   :-X are not getting the best from their music replay, until you have heard the difference serious stands can make (up to 20% in my experience dependent on your tolerance of smear and woolliness) you would not have heard your expensive gear performing at its best.  ;)

There’s talk of PCB’s sounding bad, well I guess that the voltage striking the components will cause them to go off (resonate) at different frequencies so the net result is a board singing along at varying frequencies in time to the music, maybe a reason for the hard wired valve sets of old putting in a good performance. I am guessing that some electrical ‘coupling’ will also be taking place through radiated fields and close proximity.  :'(

Decoupling cones / spikes are easy to hear beneath Speakers as Flemo reported, harder beneath CD players and alike because here they are not resonating furiously like a non optimal speaker cabinet is or coupling to a large area floor (which may be a suspended wooden arrangement) or more typically in Oz a concrete floor; this does not mean to say it’s not coupling, even the manufactures have resorted to fitting decouplers to the base of their kit in the form of low cost rubber discs typical of Phillips or more massy (flashy) spun ali discs (Esoteric and the likes). :-[

Having now heard what a higher quality resonator (Zenclock) can do in the front end of a CD replay system I am even more determined to ensure individual components are tuned for improved replay.  ::)
My old mates used to take a roll of lead to hifi shows and place on top of speakers adding around 30 Kg mass, everyone could hear the difference for the better, make sure to place some hifi comics beneath the lead or you’ll be ejected!

So I lay down a challange, how do the different materials effect replay when used beneath equipment, i.e. is it warmer / clearer / colder / sharper etc.  Hopefully this will raise some interesting results.  Please list the exact piece of equipment used or it's not as valuable to us tweaky dedicated types.

I'll start, toughened glass shelf beneath - Linn Sondek - harder faster sound with apparent focus on the mid and highs but ultimately wearing. (this in comaprison to the sound organisations chipboard shelf on a steel box section frame).  over to you guys.

oh oh here's another one - Micromega CD player-mounted onto a multi sectioned hardwood varnished chopping board (larger than the component) - better micro detail and tightening of sound across the board.
V
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.