Author Topic: Radford Reissue  (Read 10496 times)

Offline omodo

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Radford Reissue
« on: March 10, 2012, 06:50:06 AM »
http://www.radfordrevival.co.uk/sta-reissue/

Interesting, transformers wound in UK, but not much other info

STA-15 2750 GBP
STA-20 2800 GBP

Offline data

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2012, 10:32:54 AM »
Four and a half grand  :o Nice big power transformer.

Mario will love that internal shot  :D
« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 10:34:46 AM by data »

Offline zenelectro

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2012, 11:24:46 AM »
Four and a half grand  :o Nice big power transformer.

Mario will love that internal shot  :D

For $4k5, I'll have plated through holes on my circuit board please or better still point to point.

Not the best design WRT servicing. The boards have to be removed or tipped up to get access to the
solder joints to replace any components.

Plated through holes would allow components to be easily de soldered / removed without touching the boards.
Additionally they are just plain more robust. Expected on a <$1k Mexican made guitar amp, but on a hi-end product
they should try a bit harder???

Still - they look nice and may well sound great :)

PS cleaned up my post was a bit stroppy :)


« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 01:17:15 PM by zenelectro »

Offline vitavoxdude

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2012, 02:02:32 PM »
Not surprised Terry you had to tone it down  :-X
It looks like a Target's version of a service mans nightmare.  :'(
Cheap looking valve bases, nasty caps and resistors with lots of interconnecting wiring, all a long way from service friendly and traditionly built but the PCB's reduce costs for the manufacture. Despite all this it is still being shirt salesman priced.  Compare this to Far eastern products and it's vastly overpriced.  They are obviously trading on the old name and hoping to attract some rich punters.  They will probably argue that back in the 60's when these were first produced they were equaly priced in terms of currency value and therefor offer good value for money.  Some of us know better.  I also spy that the socket on the back of the amp is not even wired in which means it's a demo model.  The audio game has got to be even tougher in the current climate so I applaud these guys for trying to regenerate a past icon but they really need to get into the real world and go through a redesign, ditch the PCB's and use components that do not make you want to look for a bucket.
V ::)
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline omodo

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2012, 02:46:43 PM »
interesting points, but almost predictable ::)

The original was built on a single sided phenolic pcb (ditching the pcb... really??), with no through hole plating, so perhaps the style of construction was chosen to be historically accurate and poor serviceability an inherent compromise



To be fair parts choices cannot be questioned without first listening to it, it could sound great as zenelectro said. The parts may have been selected to keep the original voicing, or not. I don't know this, and I'm pretty sure you don't either, so I would think it's unfair to speculate either way about parts choice, or that it could sound like sh!t (from looking at a photo of all things), in a public medium such as this?

Pricing compared to the far east, well that depends where it is made, if fully assembled in the UK then I would think it's fair? Anyway, it's not far off the price of some locally assembled DACs...... perhaps they too could adopt a far east pricing model?

Offline stevenvalve

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2012, 03:38:51 PM »
interesting points, but almost predictable ::)

The original was built on a single sided phenolic pcb (ditching the pcb... really??), with no through hole plating, so perhaps the style of construction was chosen to be historically accurate and poor serviceability an inherent compromise



To be fair parts choices cannot be questioned without first listening to it, it could sound great as zenelectro said. The parts may have been selected to keep the original voicing, or not. I don't know this, and I'm pretty sure you don't either, so I would think it's unfair to speculate either way about parts choice, or that it could sound like sh!t (from looking at a photo of all things), in a public medium such as this?

Pricing compared to the far east, well that depends where it is made, if fully assembled in the UK then I would think it's fair? Anyway, it's not far off the price of some locally assembled DACs...... perhaps they too could adopt a far east pricing model?
I recently had an original 1960s Radford STR 25 mark 3, and i will say it sounded fantastic, ran 4 EL34s. It may have been the best push pull amp i have ever heard,  the sum of the parts is what matters, and Radford transformers where and are brilliant, so what do they do, They are changing the materials in this new reissue and that is fraunt with danger, often it is the original materials that give these fabulous old amps the magic, Big mistake in my opinion. Look at audionote they changed the dielectric in there caps from  paper in oil and they lost that special magic.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 03:42:12 PM by stevenvalve »

Offline omodo

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2012, 03:40:42 PM »
No doubt and I agree 100%

Offline kajak12

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2012, 11:59:37 PM »
http://www.radfordrevival.co.uk/sta-reissue/

Interesting, transformers wound in UK, but not much other info

STA-15 2750 GBP
STA-20 2800 GBP
omodo tell bill about this he might get one or post the link on sna with any luck some punter will buy,and if you wait long enough you can pick it up on sna forsale section.
i would like to listen and then modd one.
still discovering the link between electronics and audio reproduction.so much to learn and so little time

Offline vitavoxdude

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2012, 02:21:24 AM »

Re: Radford Reissue

Quote 'interesting points, but almost predictable'

Yes anticipated  ???, Now that the design is >25 years old it's out of patent so some jump on the bandwagon and produce reissues.  Sum of the parts indeed.
If it is all made in the UK then they have done well to constrain the price to around 5 grand, can anyone find out?  I am not knocking the dedicated types that do such reissues, maybe it's even a relative of the original team.  Some one please buy me one, pretty please?????
We all like different things so lets all agree to disagree and if any common ground is found then worship it.  Mine is the KD hence being present on this forum.

Offline data

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2012, 02:48:55 AM »
Wasn't there another build here in Australia?

I remember something about a year ago?

They boasted about some ridicules resistor culling of one in every 10.000 or something.

Edit: Found it, Radford inspired  STA-25
http://www.rola.net.au/radford.htm

I wa s wrong in the one in 10.000, they state "Our yield is only 100 in every 10,000 parts" and relates the parts in the phono section.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2012, 02:59:15 AM by data »

Offline zenelectro

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2012, 12:50:41 PM »
interesting points, but almost predictable ::)

The original was built on a single sided phenolic pcb (ditching the pcb... really??), with no through hole plating, so perhaps the style of construction was chosen to be historically accurate and poor serviceability an inherent compromise



To be fair parts choices cannot be questioned without first listening to it, it could sound great as zenelectro said. The parts may have been selected to keep the original voicing, or not. I don't know this, and I'm pretty sure you don't either, so I would think it's unfair to speculate either way about parts choice, or that it could sound like sh!t (from looking at a photo of all things), in a public medium such as this?

Pricing compared to the far east, well that depends where it is made, if fully assembled in the UK then I would think it's fair? Anyway, it's not far off the price of some locally assembled DACs...... perhaps they too could adopt a far east pricing model?
I recently had an original 1960s Radford STR 25 mark 3, and i will say it sounded fantastic, ran 4 EL34s. It may have been the best push pull amp i have ever heard,  the sum of the parts is what matters, and Radford transformers where and are brilliant, so what do they do, They are changing the materials in this new reissue and that is fraunt with danger, often it is the original materials that give these fabulous old amps the magic, Big mistake in my opinion. Look at audionote they changed the dielectric in there caps from  paper in oil and they lost that special magic.

Steven do you know of a circuit for this amp?

Offline data

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2012, 01:17:38 PM »
« Last Edit: March 11, 2012, 01:21:17 PM by data »

Offline zenelectro

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2012, 04:04:54 PM »
http://www.radfordrevival.co.uk/sta-reissue/

Interesting, transformers wound in UK, but not much other info

STA-15 2750 GBP
STA-20 2800 GBP
omodo tell bill about this he might get one or post the link on sna with any luck some punter will buy,and if you wait long enough you can pick it up on sna forsale section.
i would like to listen and then modd one.

Mario,

You are probably better off building a PP EL34 amp from scratch.
I can see this in your future.

Data,

Thanks for link, circuit looks very simple and has some pretty unique things in it.

Offline data

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2012, 04:21:53 PM »
Can't say I understand everything in that circuit (noob here), but thought the selectable output with different amounts of feedback for each, interesting.

Am I right in seeing high levels of GNF in those?

Edit: Not that there is anything particularly wrong with that...
« Last Edit: March 11, 2012, 04:52:51 PM by data »

Offline zenelectro

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2012, 10:54:30 PM »
Can't say I understand everything in that circuit (noob here), but thought the selectable output with different amounts of feedback for each, interesting.

Am I right in seeing high levels of GNF in those?

Edit: Not that there is anything particularly wrong with that...

They are actually switching the FB along with the OP impedance. So if you use a 16 ohm tap,
the FB comes from the 16 ohm tap, if you use 4 ohm tap, FB comes from that tap.

It is actually a VG way to do it.

Offline data

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2012, 11:12:12 PM »
Yes indeed :)

I see the switching at the taps.
I was just wondering about the levels of FB applied, just that I haven't seen a resistor in series with the cap in the FB circuit, without that resistor in series I wound imagine the FB to be pretty high, just that I don't know what effect that resistor in series has on the circuit.

EdiT: after another look.

Sorry for picking ya' brain Zen, just that you have a wealth of knowledge here, and I'm wearing L plates  :D
« Last Edit: March 11, 2012, 11:28:47 PM by data »

Offline Jehuty

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #16 on: March 13, 2012, 12:11:58 PM »
Another old reissue:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/300678070017?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:VRI&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2661

I'd love to get the original STA 15 or 25 mk 3, prices have soared in the past one year however  >:(
« Last Edit: March 13, 2012, 12:13:35 PM by Jehuty »
Not all that matters can be measured, not all that can be measured matters.

Offline omodo

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2012, 08:52:13 PM »
Hi, yes I made the post knowing your interest in the Radfords.. unfortunately there is only one way that prices will go on vintage audio, unless the europeans? start dumping stuff but I figure most of the collectors are in SE Asia..

Anyway, there have been some comments about the reissue posted on the Radford yahoo group recently

Quote
Just thought I would put the record straight and give the complete picture:

As some of you know I 'rescued' the Radford brand name some years ago to keep it
British. Originally I planned, and had designed by one of the UK's finest valve
amplifier designers, a Mk6 version of the STA25 which took the circuit concept
to its ultimate limits. Unfortunately the price of that unit was considered too
high by many to be a product that was viable (if made in the UK).

I did flirt with the idea of having it made in China, as many valve amps are
now, but I felt that was not right for the British pedigree of Radford.

I was therefore delighted to be contacted by Steve Moores regarding his plans
for a revival of the original Radford amps and am delighted to be working with
him and Will to bring the brand back to life.

We have a lot of ideas regarding the future of Radford but, for now, the
'revival' is well under way with the classics that Steve and Will are producing.

I have to say that I've had a look under the lid of these classics and they are
superb in their attention to detail. To my eye the transformers are actually
built to a superior performance to the originals - not too surprising
considering Steve's background knowledge of Arthur's winding specifications.

Thank you all for your interest in these 'new' models and if you have any
further queries I'm sure Will can answer them.

Peter Comeau

Quote
Thank you for your positive comments about our project, we have put a lot of
effort into it.

Regarding the issue with the name, we had a meeting with Peter Comeau himself
and he gave us permission to use the Radford name on these products.

These are intended to be high quality remakes of the original series
3 STAs and not entirely new products (though physically new!)

They really are very authentic, the transformers are wound to the exact original
specifications, which we have the original copies of.

Quote
I haven't posted for ages,but I love reading all the
comments,suggestions,ect.,and I am convinced uncle Arthur would be delighted
with yours,and everyone else's efforts,Peter,to keep Radford British.

Congratulations and keep it going!!!

Good luck,
Best regards,
John Radford.

Offline Jehuty

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2012, 09:53:58 PM »
Quote
These are intended to be high quality remakes of the original series
3 STAs and not entirely new products (though physically new!)

They really are very authentic, the transformers are wound to the exact original
specifications, which we have the original copies of.

Sounds very promising, would love to listen to one when opportunity arises. This is also a good news for anyone who wants to replace their Radford's blown up OPTs. Thanks for the info D.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2012, 09:55:51 PM by Jehuty »
Not all that matters can be measured, not all that can be measured matters.

Offline ozmillsy

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Re: Radford Reissue
« Reply #19 on: June 08, 2012, 08:38:02 PM »
Radford party at SV's last night......



2 x 15's and a 25.

We had loads of fun tube rolling on the 3 different units.   Opened the amp, and the guts were very different on all of them.  
It's all about the music,, not the equipment.