Author Topic: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192  (Read 166519 times)

Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #160 on: January 08, 2014, 08:36:14 AM »
to the managers of this site:

could you please check the possibilities for interested DIYers to have access to your site? they send me this:



and to Doede as well, and complain not to be allowed to enter? I can not believe that this is the policy here?

please tell me

Offline stevenvalve

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #161 on: January 08, 2014, 05:00:28 PM »
rhlauranna. We had to close it because of the spammers. I will open it now.

Offline stevenvalve

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #162 on: January 08, 2014, 09:19:50 PM »
rhlauranna. I have to close it again, Two many spammers we are going to upgrade the software.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2014, 04:03:43 PM by stevenvalve »

Offline Jehuty

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #163 on: January 08, 2014, 10:13:16 PM »
rhlauranna, perhaps you could be a mediator between your friends and the admin. Get them to be a member so that they can get a full view of the forum. Let the admin know the details and I'm sure they can work on this.
Not all that matters can be measured, not all that can be measured matters.

Offline stevenvalve

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #164 on: January 08, 2014, 11:17:34 PM »
rhlauranna I can register your friends instantly. Just pm me

Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #165 on: January 08, 2014, 11:41:51 PM »
thanks for all your responses... I have passed them on here:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-line-level/224108-nos-192-24-dac-pcm1794-waveio-usb-input-88.html

so, if you like, there are indeed - as Doede confirmed - some really ambitious and ingenious DIYers over there who have many a good idea and are pushing things further as well with tubes and caps and...

enjoy...

« Last Edit: January 08, 2014, 11:46:25 PM by rhlauranna »

Offline ozmillsy

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #166 on: January 09, 2014, 07:28:43 AM »
Just confirming Stevens earlier post,  the intention is definitely to have an open forum for anyone to read, and for anyone to join and contribute.

The forum version we are on appears to have some exploits where spammers can attack the forum, when we turn on anonymous read access.

We're investigating an upgrade to the forum software, to fix this. But for the time being, we need to turn off anonymous access.   

We're happy to manually register people in the interim.  No problem.
It's all about the music,, not the equipment.

Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #167 on: January 18, 2014, 10:42:56 PM »
there is some interesting discussion about optimizing the interna of the computer here:

http://www.highend-audiopc.com/reviews.html

and here is some discussion:

http://jplay.eu/forum/computer-audio/release-of-new-windows-server-2012-audiophile-core-edition-this-weekend/page-11/#p14895

are there any practical experiences out there ??
« Last Edit: January 18, 2014, 11:00:18 PM by rhlauranna »

Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #168 on: January 29, 2014, 08:21:55 AM »
closer to the truth, part 4

(the full report may now be seen/read as well on Stefano's site

http://twogoodears.blogspot.it/2014/01/a-new-reinhard-huttenburgs-review.html

as he finally managed to get the pictures imported...)

well, latest with the new assembly of the DDDAC1794 we are now able to precisely generate frequencies which come for example from instruments like this and which very heavily define the whole sound in any system, the transport and the reproducion of those are other chapters...


 
to give you an impression of what changes now simply from measurements done all at 1.000 cycles (an "easy" frequency, where everywhere in electronics the world is totally "o.k." and just "fine", and not an extreme one where the set definitely has to show what it is really capable of, but already here the differences are very very obvious), please have a look at this picture which I got from Klaus just the other day showing Decca London Jubilee pick-up and Philips LHH 1000 CD Player... these "insufficiencies" and "imponderabilities" will presumably "shock" many a vinyl-aficionado and "normal" CD-player reproducers ... and I can assure you: this is not only viewable (as is the difference from HDTV to Ultra HDTV), but precisely listenable at the same "level"...


 
and here are the fantastic results of Doede's genious masterpiece which speak for themselves at 1.000 cycles


 
and at 20 cycles (and this is indeed even more incredible!!!)


 
...so, this is as close to "perfection" as it gets, anyway - no matter if analogue or digital, tube or transistor or whatever...

...and it is rather simple: if you do not have your sources/squares like this right in the beginning, you will not be able to amplify and reproduce and listen to exactly this, so, one of the biggest secrets in HiFi is revealed: you have to possess and you must be able to generate a "perfect" input...

for more, have a look here:

http://www.dddac.com/dddac1794_test_specs.html


and now for quite some time we found out that we are not alone...

oooohhhhh, how I do enjoy passionate DIYers who in the first line do not preach how "friendly" they are and others should be, but who possess the know-how as well as the skills to whip the really relevant developments further and bring them to the point or at least undertake everything to get there and are capable of explaining and expressing the ameliorating differences... (especially those "things" where Doede tells that he already very much would have liked to try them all out but because of lack of time was not yet able to...)

...they are rare those DIYers, but they are out there, and it is a great pleasure to get to know them.. well, one of those rare guys is "Supersurfer", from the Netherlands, that I happened to get to know rather short time ago on this site:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-line-level/224108-nos-192-24-dac-pcm1794-waveio-usb-input-99.html

...by the way, this is  t h e  site where Doede personally takes care for all the DIYers problems and questions regarding his DDDACs, and it is a real treasure box to get to know about the developments and experiences which others have made with the same "product" developing with different parts into different directions and levels...

as you all know at the moment we concentrate on digital streaming via our DDDACs, i.e. version 1543 for 16 Bit, and version 1794 for 24 Bit.. and within this development, which by now lasts for about three till four years, we thought having come rather far and being on top of the iceberg...

...but to my greatest delight I discovered "Supersurfer" being still further ahead than us, having already experimented and performed those things that I still am dreaming of and which hopefully will lead to a cooperation...

now you presumably want to know, what this is all about?

Well, the first "thing" that differs from our DAC constructions here is the implementation of so-called "Shunt-regulators"...

for more information have a look here:

http://www.tentlabs.com/Components/cdupgrade/shunt/index.html

As far as I can see "Supersurfer" uses four of them for each deck. And I like to quote him regarding his results because I have no doubt that it is exactly like that; "The tent shunts do make a big difference in openness, dynamics and low level detail. I am very satisfied with my 4 decks with 16 shunts." O.K. And how does that look like? Well, like this:

(Supersurfer: please pardon, when using your own pictures, but I think it is that important, that it is justified... thanks)


 
the DDDAC1794 with two decks and the small green plates (the Shunt-regulators)
and the view from the top


 
the second big "thing" is the implementation of an Ultra CompactFlash Disk with 30 MB/s and a capacity of 8 GB working in nanoseconds and not in milliseconds... to be seen on the bottom left of the picture, the small red-grey square... I told you already elsewhere that reproducing digital stream from PC's own RAM - as well in nanoseconds - was one of the greatest discovery in sound amelioration...


 
(Tuyen: if you should read this, you directed me to a japanese (?) site a year ago or so, where they already had something like this in use, in combination with three super-big transformors - at that time I found it something like too much dimensioned and "ridiculous", but now we know exactly why this is right - and a studio-loudness-level-attenuator, which all seemed utopian and miles ahead of us... would you please indicate again what site that was ? Thanks... why? because time has come for us to concentrate exactly on the further development of the interna of our PCs... and they seem to have made already very interesting and thrilling progresses on which we possibly can lean on...)

...and yet another very spectacular and very astonishing proceed is the undressing of the output caps, i.e. the de-isolation and their newly disguising with (normal?) paper and wooden surrounding said by "Supersurfer" being much "better" in sound, much more open and much more dynamic...


 
wow, wow, wow, I am really not that easily to convince, and till this moment I do not have tried this all out, but all this seems to make big sense and me really nervous, so, we will see...
 


...and this is "Supersurfer's" actual setup of "his" DDDAC1794 Quadriga (i.e. four decks):

"- 4 dac boards

- modified on board shunt regulators (Tent labs), 16 in total

- Audio Note Tantalum resistors

- salas shunt regulators for the dac and wave IO

- balanced connection to input transformer of my tube amps (audio consulting silver volume transformers)

- alix computer board with mpd pup software and linear power supply (tried raspberry pi first but it is not powerfull enough)

- streaming from a NAS

- all controlled with Mpad ipad interface (Super Cool and easy!)"

...and if you should like to read (not only) "Supersurfer's" statement about his/Doede's DAC, please feel free to read here, # 602:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-line-level/224108-nos-192-24-dac-pcm1794-waveio-usb-input-61.html#post3706675

What ideas! What plans! What an execution! And without having listened to, what a delight to look at first sight..

Bravo !!!
« Last Edit: January 29, 2014, 08:45:16 AM by rhlauranna »

Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192 part 1
« Reply #169 on: February 18, 2014, 10:07:37 AM »
"The" day of the days in HiFi-history...

well, not to exaggerate all the time in order not to become untrustworthy, I thought for myself in the past how to describe all our discoveries the best way, most neutral, the situation as is actually, not more but also not less, and the phrase "closer to the truth..." came to my mind, me at that time not yet really knowing but more longing for what "the truth" lastly is in reality...

and for quite some time I felt that this was a good approach for that what we are doing here now for about four years and that it would perfectly fit for the description of our ambitions...

but, now, exactly since 15th february 2014, things not only have reached a new level, they have reached "the truth" (an asymptotic process of course, but very close in completely reaching), so please, bear with me in the future when I am talking about "reaching the truth...", with all scientific progresses that have been reached so far, this now indeed is "more" realistic than "closer to the truth..."

but let me tell you the story one by one...

first, who were all the participants?



from left to right: me, Thomas Nöltner, Bernd Wieland (like the real champion with one of his feet on his/my controlled power supply for 5 and 12 Volt), Doede Douma, Klaus Speth, Jean Hiraga, Bruno Plouvier, Prof. Shii, Dirk Wunderlich

so, as you might know the usual "mad" followers are:

1. Jean Hiraga (who really needs no introduction, but nowadays has become an ultra close follower of all the things that we do here and the stuff that we build for ourselves and which the industry not at all seems to be interested in... having begun to build up his "own" stuff regarding digital streaming with a new power supply for the (DD)DAC(s) which of course he had brought with him for testing purposes





top view of the new Jean Hiraga power supply for 5 and 12 Volt



front view of the new Jean Hiraga power supply for 5 and 12 Volt



and the new transformer on Jean's power supply with specifications, which Bernd very much admired...

2. Doede Douma, meanwhile hopefully known to you all and to be seen and read on his two sites:

DDDAC 1794 NOS DAC - Non Oversampling DAC with PCM1794 - no digital filter - modular design DIY DAC for high resolution audio 192/24 192kHz 24bit

and

DDDAC 2000

3. Klaus of course, and Moni, his wife, our generous hosts, who cared for our all being well... thanks a ton for all your hospitality, delicious choucroute with freshly mashed potatoes, tasty chicken soup, sausages (Jean brought some with him from France as well), eggs, baguettes and all kinds of drinks like beer, limo, water, Coca-Cola...







...and yes, of course, we all know: nobody drinks Coca-Cola, but after the session more than two cases with 20 bottles à 0,33 ltr. each had delighted all the "hard working" listeners... and to what delight: see picture...

4. Bernd, the great guru who first developed controlled power supplies and other specialities and who brought Doede on to the path with his own power supplies...

5. Jean and me, the two of us just side by side of "our ultra toys", two DDDAC1543 with 120 chips each and Bernd's and Jean's new controlled power supplies (to the left in front)



and the following guests:

6. Mr Shizuang Shii, a professor of mathematics at the university in Rennes/France...



...here together with Doede, preparing the next listening test with DDDAC1543-120chips...

Prof. Shii has just got a DDDAC1794 with eight decks from Doede, and he is owner and constructor of a completely self-built highest end system from another universe... I simply have no other words for that what I have seen on some pictures...







...later on I will try to show a little bit more of what that man is doing - this is incredible for me, and I would very much like to have a listen to his system perhaps one day - building his own compression drivers (!), yes, from scratch, and a power supply alone for his pre-amp with some 100 kg in weight (in words: one hundred kilograms), with embedded tubes which are normally only in use for military purposes (and which Doede of course knows very well and of which he owns two... would anybody have thought different? No, not really, or...?)

7. Bruno, from France, a friend and "collaborateur" of Jean, a very nice guy, with very very good ears - it was really big fun with him not only see him playing some imaginative air-guitar while some blues was playing, but speaking the "same" language, technically and musically - not only an intense HiFi-friend, but a friend of good eating and drinking alike, as to be seen on the photo (here cutting some french artisan sausages for the gang which Jean brought with him as a gift - and they both have much fun obviously)...



...proudly owning a DDDAC1543 with 120 chips - exactly like mine



...but nowadays in combination with the new power supply for especially this DAC from Jean Hiraga...

8. yes, and for the first time we had two ambitious guys out of the south-german HiFi-fan-camp as our guests: Thomas Nöltner and Dirk Wunderlich...



Thomas to the very left, Dirk second from the right, and Moni, Klaus's wife, right in the middle

...they both are very qualified DIYers with great experience in vintage-speakers and amps and drivers, not at all shy to build their own stuff... we got to know them for the first time when we visited André in northern France last octobre... if you might be interested, have a look here:

TWOGOODEARS - ??????????: A Reinhard Huttenburg's essay - "Is it possible to combine futuristic music sources with a 100 year old loudspeaker system?"


second: what was the meeting all about?

well, Prof. Shii, Bruno Plouvier, Thomas Nöltner and Dirk Wunderlich primarily had come to listen to Klaus's system as a whole, that system, of which they already had heard so much about... and they were lucky men, especially lucky men because in addition of being part of the "mad" followers who wanted to test and try out very specific things which ultimately culminated in the fullfilment of my very very personal long time ever hard core dream: "perfect" HiFi ! And yes, I do not only "dare" to say "perfect", I do say it is perfect! As perfect as it can get in reproduction. With absolute conviction, although I know already some things how to further ameliorate Klaus's sound... yes, ameliorations within HiFi-heaven... the only pity is that especially "this" result presumably for most HiFi-aficionados will remain out of reach...


so, what is it exactly, that I am talking about?

well, that what I have been chasing for during all my HiFi-live, and this since 1965, so for 49 years now, that what has come "true" !!! A very very long time dream hardly ever imaginable being fullfilled. My stomoch all the years told me that it could be true perhaps one day, but there never ever seemed to be a "real" way to reach it... but finally digital won the race... (just like Ultra HDTV and more...)

...during our long time research we acquired the best speakers/drivers on the globe, we built the best pre-amps, channel deviders, power amps by ourselves (in the sense that input equals output with absolutely perfect squares from 1 cycle to nearly 100.000 cycles), bult our own DDDACs, created our own digital rips, and within this very session on 15th of february we learned/experienced/heard/listened for the first time what it really means to "perfectly" generate a given "perfect" source and stream digital with DDDACs in all their glory...

so, we are long time "prepared" for amplifying squares and then reproducing them with our drivers and horns... but we never ever had "perfect" conditions and squares in the origin, right in the beginning... well, this problem is solved now, with both of the DDDACs, and not only with perfect rips of CDs and SACDs (ISO/DFF), but in transporting them the way they ought to be transported... and because nobody could help us in doing this, we had to find it out by ourselves... and exactly the last secrets in reproducing music now could be revealed in our lastest session with this theme today: DDDACs total..

What does that mean? Well, we long time have been "waiting" for the "fullfilment" in the developments of the DDDACs... it was not that easy to embed always and immediately all the latest results in research into the given DACs, but this now has come to a wonderful and indeed glorious finish: both DDDACs were ready to be tested against one another with the "maximum" of chips (i.e. 240 for the DDDAC1543) and eight decks with the DDDAC1794 (which is 16 chips, two on each deck)...



...most of you presumably know the view onto the DDDAC1543 with 120 chips...



...but this should be new: for the first time the combination of the two DDDAC1543 with 120 chips to one DDDAC1543 with 240 (!) chips...

...and yes, when we started with digital and got used to it, I always thought, o.k. one computer is just fine, but hey, have a look, meanwhile we have running three of them at the same time, side by side... who would have thought that?



Doede taming all the "lions", making them working homogeneously together...



...searching for the "right" connections...



... and adjusting all the 1543 towers, which are now 20 of them (!),  to get everything just exactly perfect...

and now what ? yes, that's what it is all about, the DDDAC1543 with 240 chips



here the two DDDAC1543 with 120 chips each - side by side, not yet connected

...but after getting connected ready to be tested in combination with three different controlled power supplies for 5  a n d  12 Volt:

1. the one from Bernd



2. Doede's





3. and Jean's



So, what did we do exactly? We tested the combined "total amount" of the DDDAC1543 with 240 chips in combination with three controlled power supplies: Bernd's, Doede's and the new one from Jean...

...for me - as a non physician - 5 Volt and 12 Volt always have been 5 Volt and 12 Volt, not to be moved or changed at all, like the Mount Everest, but ooohhh, how wrong I was, not only me, all participants had to learn an unbelievable lesson: the sound of different controlled power supplies generating exactly these "5" and "12" Volt is not just a little different, the sound changes that dramatically that one has to hear it to believe... it is like listening to nearly a different system each time... and this is some sort of deviant... so never ever trust just 5 and 12 Volt...

to be continued
« Last Edit: February 20, 2014, 09:46:07 PM by rhlauranna »

Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192 part 2
« Reply #170 on: February 18, 2014, 10:08:38 AM »
...

well, but how did each power supply perform in the end ? Now, all power supplies performed on an absolutely ultra level, without a doubt, and one might think that there are hardly any differences. Why? Because they are all built to "perfection", but nevertheless there were quite big differences in sound when being played, just puzzeling one's mind, and at first sight it was really hard to understand and to experience these "differences"... lastly every single controlled power supply has its merits in its own way, while Doede's being definitely the "quickest"...

...and perhaps it is that quickness that leads to that different results... to describe them is very hard, they are there, but they are that way that one has to hear them... for example Bruno heard them as well, and it is just one opinion, he jokingly told me: "Hi Reinhard, if you let me  y o u r  DDDAC1543 and  y o u r power supply, everything is fine, and we remain friends!" Hey, what a result ? And how funny is that ?

...but this was just one of the topics that interested us most, the "influence" on the sound being fed by "perfect" 5 and 12 Volt (you remember: the 5 Volt for the DAC are not served via PC/MAC but as well externally by the different controlled power supplies, which "shoot" the music immediately into heaven...

...there was another topic, which could not be tested isolated, but only in combination: how would the sound change when all physical necessities are pushed to all their limits, i.e. with the DDDAC1543 with 16 Bit, with the maximum amount of chips, i.e. 16 times 16 = 256? well, we did it "only" with 240, and the newly finished DDDAC1794 with eight decks, i.e. 16 chips... and how would "this" sound "behave" in combination with these three different controlled power supplies...

well, just a second, believe me, for 24 hours I have been searching for "the" right word that suits the result best, and I finally came to the conclusion that "erotic", and yes, even "orgiastic" describes it best...

but please, do not believe that it was only me who had that impression...

1. Jean after some seconds of listening to Youn Sun Nah's voice: My Favorite Things, Album: Some Girl, which truely sounded sublime and erotic - I would have liked to be the microphone she has been singing in...



...immediately screamed out (and I never ever heard Jean screaming out before): "Wow" and "incredible"... and he nearly "jumped" onto my lap, out of pure joy, and the joy was not only a normal joy, it was exactly that joy and feeling that fullfills a life time dream...

2. Prof. Shii, who was very modest and reserved, and who presumably is not that easy to be moved to eruptions of luck, was very very impressed, and he happily claimed: "This is very very hot, and cool!"

3. And Bruno, yes Bruno, he talked in pictures which everybody immediately understands: "My teeth are falling down..."

...and this was exactly the same experience and the same reaction that we had at the end of december last year, when testing out all possibilities with the DDDAC1794 with eight decks and controlled power supplies with and without Sowters, Mundorfs..., with results which we then thought being typical for the 24 Bit chip, but they are not... for more, read here:

TWOGOODEARS - ??????????: A new Reinhard Huttenburg's review... a scientific gathering at Klaus' place - December 2013

...to me it is clear now that the ultimate precision which these chips are able to generate, significantly depends on the amount of multiplied parallel chips and decks in combination with controlled power supplies for 5 and 12 Volt, and that they not only dramatically ameliorate the sound but equally reduce the jitter which leads to a breathtaking cleanness and naturality (definitely taking away all digititis if there is any...), and it is clear as well that only this way these chips are capable to reveal their definitely best qualities...

well, it is always interesting to listen to "other" people's music, and so we listened to all the stuff, that everybody had brought with him, for example CDs, but as well all sorts of rips in all resolutions up to 24 Bit 192 kHz, and of course ISO/DSD/DFF...



Les Introuvables de Pierre Fournier, EMI Classics



Daniil Shafran, Cello, Encore



Forastière - Rag Tap Boom



Lee Ritenour - 6 String Theory



Wagner - Lohengrin, Daniel Barenboim



Stereoplay - "Ultimate Tunes 2", and "Live aus dem Hörraum"

well, after really extended listening for some ten hours or so with all different kinds of music, jazz, rock, pop, classic.... ranging from pianissimo to fortissimo, to my ears, there is no "loser", both DDDACs are clear winners, but they are a little bit different in their own sound, especially when they are brought to that point, where they are able to reveal their own character... I mean the differences which are chip-immanent then are clearly be heard, the own sound characteriscics of each chip are revealed...

...one might argue, that in direct comparison the 1543 ultimately perhaps delivers a little bit more "punch", right, and that the 1794 maybe delivers some more "natural smoothness" (of course in absolutely positive sense), right as well... it would perhaps be "ideal" to have both in one, but that doesn't work...

anyway with both DACs you are clearly that far in HiFi-heaven where you ever wanted to be but never ever got before...

...and even Doede, who had - at least to my impression - some sort of written down his DDDAC1543, was confronted with some newly superb acoustic surprises provoked by his own masterpiece which so far had not yet been discovered and experienced, till now, but which came out as that "dramatically good" that five participants immediately wanted a 240 DDDAC, hardly any longer speaking a word about the DDDAC1543 with 120 chips or the DDDAC1794.... because the sound is that much better, i.e. erotic and orgiastic !!!

...yes, and even the hardest vinyl aficionados among us admitted that meanwhile many a thing has changed to the better within digital domain and that it would be highly interesting to directly compare the performance of vinyl "against" digital on Klaus's system, but had to concede directly that alone from dynamics vinyl no longer would be able to compete with digital... and that not only for higher and highest 24 bit resolution files but especially for 16 bit !!!

so, my personal decision is clear: I opt for the 240 chips, as wanted most of the other participants of the session,  a  n  d   I will keep of course my DDDAC1794, next step here for me is to mount from 4 decks to 8 decks, not only because of the capability to play high resolution files (by the way, the DDDAC1543 with the new WaveIO-Board is capable of playing up to 24 Bits and 88 kHz and supplying external 5 Volt as well (and in what a mindblowing quality !!!), but because the ultimate researches and developments ih high resolution still have not yet been finished... there are still more things to discover, so for example we want to try out 16 decks, shunt regulators, different resistors... we will see...

so, all those of you who are interested to learn more about what is already going on within further developments, might want to have a look onto the page for really advanced DIYers regarding the DDDAC1794 with all sorts of progression and proceeds... please have a look here....

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-line-level/224108-nos-192-24-dac-pcm1794-waveio-usb-input-103.html

and here of course on the bottom

TWOGOODEARS - ??????????: A new Reinhard Huttenburg's review... a scientific gathering at Klaus' place - December 2013

it is understood that we all are very urgently waiting for the next definitive results of these steps, and be assured, they will be done in the near future...

well, we had meetings and meetings and meetings in the past... they all were fun, big fun, without a doubt.. and I have them all in such a vivid remembrance, as if they were yesterday... but this absolutely special session here developed some sort of a dynamic range on its own, everybody got "wings" so to speak... this was not planned, this could not be imagined, it just happened, presumably caused by the topic... and I have no explanation for this but the absolute sublime superbness of the performances...

...have a look at how busy and deeply involved everybody is..



...in listening...



...in bringing things together and running...



...in preheating the controlled power supplies to reach just the "right" temperatur...



.. in precisely adjusting the volume control...



...in "rechecking" what they are listening to...



...in measuring and adjusting the exactly needed voltages...



...and when all things are just exactly perfect adjusted just enjoying the
best sound ever in the sweet spot, hardly trusting their own ears...

and yes, the quintessence of the meeting was not only having reached "perfection" but that all participants finally not only "understood" but indeed fully "realized" what we have been doing here the last four years...

the reactions of all participants were splendid... not to become indiscrete, but just to illustrate:

1. Jean: "Wow"... "incredible"...

2. Prof. Shii: "This is very very hot, and cool!"

3. Bruno: "My teeth are falling down!"

4. and yes, my dream came true...

...there is a saying In the german language which goes something like this: "One picture tells more than thousand words". So, please, have a look at Bruno, he brings it to the point when deeply convinced showing thumb up, sighing:





"This is the real sound..."



« Last Edit: February 20, 2014, 09:49:54 PM by rhlauranna »

Offline Tuyen

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #171 on: February 18, 2014, 11:00:41 AM »
Wowzers, thanks for taking time to share the experience Reinhard.   Glad  Jean is enjoying the 120chip tda1543 dac.  I wanted to keep it, but he was willing to pay top $ for it and it then allowed me to progress with getting more boards for my current dddac1794.

in some ways I do find the older tda1543 dac a bit more 'fuller' and richer signature.  How do you feel they differ?


Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #172 on: February 18, 2014, 09:16:43 PM »
Wowzers, thanks for taking time to share the experience Reinhard.   Glad  Jean is enjoying the 120chip tda1543 dac.  I wanted to keep it, but he was willing to pay top $ for it and it then allowed me to progress with getting more boards for my current dddac1794.

in some ways I do find the older tda1543 dac a bit more 'fuller' and richer signature.  How do you feel they differ?



Hi Tuyen,

nice to see you here again. Well, your/Jean's 120 DAC is not working/running/sounding like mine. We will have to check this out, even when using my controlled power supply the sound was far from mindblowing. In addition we found out - and we do not know if this was the general "setting" - that USB was not at all implemented/connected... so, the prerequisite to generate a sublime sound were not given, at least from our point of view... if it is/was like that: a pity...

Offline stevenvalve

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #173 on: February 18, 2014, 09:52:15 PM »
Love to hear some of these great systems, Many times in the past i have had great expectations about supposedly great sounding and fabulous looking HIFI systems, only to find they sounded like HIFI..... not real, Horns in particular have there own sonic signature, none I have heard, seem to be able to completely alleviate these problems, its always there to some degree. They have some magnificent strengths but I guess nothing is perfect.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2014, 11:28:14 PM by stevenvalve »

Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #174 on: February 18, 2014, 10:58:34 PM »
Love to hear some of these great systems, Many times in the past in have had great expectations about supposedly great sounding and fabulous looking HIFI systems, only to find they sounded like HIFI..... not real, Horns in particular have there own sonic signature, none I have heard, seem to be able to completely alleviate these problems, its always there to some degree. They have some magnificent strengths but I guess nothing is perfect.

come on over and have a listen !!!

Offline Tuyen

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #175 on: March 04, 2014, 01:16:05 AM »
Hi Tuyen,

nice to see you here again. Well, your/Jean's 120 DAC is not working/running/sounding like mine. We will have to check this out, even when using my controlled power supply the sound was far from mindblowing. In addition we found out - and we do not know if this was the general "setting" - that USB was not at all implemented/connected... so, the prerequisite to generate a sublime sound were not given, at least from our point of view... if it is/was like that: a pity...


Hi Reinhard,

I asked Deode to explain further what the issues were on the day regarding the DAC that I sold Jean Hiraga.  His reply follows:

Hi Tuyen,

Actually the USB board was not connected at all ( ?? ) did Jean or his friend to this? They were not very clear…

On the other hand there is in one tower a bad solder joint. After a few hours of playing it short cuts the clock line so that the dac stops. If you put your hand on the tower and apply some pressure, music is back for a few hours…

I am sure Jean and Bruno can fix it. Probably transport did it ….

Sound quality difference was complete debit on the used power supply from Jean. The regulated monster from Bernd is just very good…

Don’t worry, I did not hear any negative word about you …



So seems like Jean not interested in using the USB interface, if it wasn't wired up.   We both know the USB board is better sq than the SPDIF board.   The power supply made by Jean with the r-core transformer just not at the same performance as Bernd's design.

Phew! Thought I sold Jean a lemon :)

Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #176 on: March 04, 2014, 01:59:37 AM »
Hi Tuyen,

thanks for your reply... (by the way, what about that japanese site with those three monster power supplies for the pc-motherboard, the hard drive, the processor, and the professional studio attenuator? please tell me...)

yes, I initialized already to get your DDAC1543 checked by Doede himself so that it will be really "ready" for our next listening session, presumably in may...

on the other side, it seems that many people are still not aware and/or still have not yet fully understood what is really happening with USB and how things "work" with "perfect" rips, and still refuse for whatever reason to face that "new" procedure, but have heard that result and still "dream" of getting exactly "that" result with SPDIF...

this phenomenon for me is in the same league of what I told already months - meanwhile years - ago, where it somewhere came to the point that some people told that one simply cannot "listen" to certain CDs because of their "worst" ever possible quality... CDs which are so "bad" that one cannot at all listen to them or not listen to them without getting severe "headache"...

this might perhaps not be the "right" place, but as things "merge" together within digital stream I thought this nevertheless belonging to this topic here because of solving exactly this "problem"...

well, personally, with my DDDACs for years I did no longer encounter any CD which is "not listenable", a fact, that people simply didn't believe... some CDs are really badly produced, o.k., right you are, but they are not "not listenable...", at least one can listen to exactly the bad source and/or the bad implemented mastering, and the way and how they are produced and with what result... one might say: one can listen to these "bad" CDs how "wonderfully bad" they have been "generated" and/or "treated"...

but "not listenable" however for quite some time now belongs to an era where reproduction facilities had not yet been that evolved as they are today...

...not to "repeat" or to "confirm" my own listening experiences but to quote those that others have already had, people, who I definitely do not know personally (and this is just one example):

http://www.hifiwigwam.com/showthread.php?88548-Very-good-sounding-Dac-kit

"...I(t) has the sound of well sorted analogue, no listener fatigue, no CD`s that are not playable anymore..."

...but for those who are still in doubt, it is as always, like Kirkegaard already told: "Everybody has to make his own experiences..."

Offline Tuyen

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #177 on: March 04, 2014, 10:34:01 AM »
Hi Reinhard

That Japanese site is the blog diary of Hal Teramoto from Feastrex.   I having a bit of trouble finding the link at the moment. Will post when I figure out how to find it again.

As for the sd card reader and dac you mention, it is called the SDtrans384 project.   Some photos/info here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-source/142562-microsd-memory-card-transport-project-64.html

The volume controller: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/feastrex/199395-news-feastrex-japan-4.html

Tape to DSD too: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/feastrex/216402-partying-feastrex-japan-diy-phono-cartridges-dsd.html


Offline rhlauranna

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #178 on: March 05, 2014, 01:23:18 PM »
Hi Tuyen,

thanks for all your links... I have come much closer to what I am looking for, but it is not yet exactly that what I am searching... time will come...

by the way, do you know, what happened to your DDDAC1543 with 120 chips in the meantime ?

...well, Jean Hiraga has presented and used your DDDAC1543 on the last "Triode-Festival 2013" in November in Berlin...

one of the topics of the meeting was:  "Playing perfectly the “sparkling noise of SP records”", of 78 rpm records... please have a look here:

http://www.triodefestival.net/uploads/images_uploads/Jean_Hiraga_ETF2013.pdf

and read carefully Jean's very interesting and informative historical report about the development and the use of triode tubes for audiophiles right from the beginning...

and the "reproduction" of the "sparkling noise of SP records" "culminated" in the use of "your" DDDAC1543 with 120 chips in combination with Bruno Plouvier's power supply, of which I already talked about in my last report...

this was surely "good", the only question for me remains, why the performance ran via CD transport, Teac DV 50, even if it is the first version and unmodified, and not via USB ? As we both know this is "far away" of what this "combo" is capable of "generating"...

...and have a look at the squares ! This is perfect ! What more could you ever "reach" with all DIY than this ?????

the formerly postulated aim to open one day the doors of "true High fidelity” is clearly reached now, but the doors simply won't just right open via SPDIF...
« Last Edit: March 05, 2014, 01:48:01 PM by rhlauranna »

Offline Tuyen

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Re: DDDAC 1794-NOS 24-192
« Reply #179 on: March 05, 2014, 02:15:24 PM »
The PDF file with a presentation from Jean Hiraga was quite interesting to read, so thank you for sharing, Reinhard.

I'm glad Jean is making good use of the 120chip DAC.   I'm not really sure why he isn't using the USB module. Maybe he is allergic to 'computer audio' like some audiophiles I have met?    Just the thought of having to use a computer to play music makes them shiver.   They don't care how good it may perform!   The squares from an oscilloscope don't mean much to these audiophiles who don't believe there is any link between measurements and music replay :)